Plants propagated by rooted cutting from “parent” stock plants are clones as are cultures of tissue. These of course are produced by a process that differs from the way whole animals are cloned but since they are genetically identical to a single parent they are clones. The fact that tissue cultures are not typically referred to as clonal colonies does not change what they really are-groups of cells that are genetically identical to a single parent.

Which is really the whole point. Cloned meat is going to be produced from, if not only one parent, the stem cells of a very limited number of animals. The process may not have the environmental impact that anyone here wants (Personally, I suspect it’ll be more benign than farming currently is.) but it could virtually eliminate farm animal husbandry and slaughter.

I can’t disagree with anything you said. I didn’t explaing myself as well as you have. My real point was that the term can be used in a broad range of situations. I think the misunderstanding of the term leads to much of the fear reactions people have to it. FWIW you can also induce some pretty unholy genetic alterations in plants and animals, that could not remotely be called cloning.
I still maintain that to manufacture that much “cultured meat” you would need the protein to feed and grow them. Would this not have to come from a source, probably corn, that would produce considerable waste to produce?

You’re right. We have created a cultural value of quantity over quality. I learning to cook at an early age(or any age) is a basic part of education that helps us to make better value judgments.”‘organic’ or ‘humanely produced’ or ‘locally sourced’ or anything new fangled,” will naturally, probably, follow.

I used Smithfield as an example because of what it represents. We have the wealth and public demand for the huge volume they can produce. We have the surplus grain to feed the animals in the massive numbers, to reach massive proportions, to meet our volume and price demands. We have the transportation system to centralize production and apply the techniques of industrial manufacturing. We even use medical science to keep these animals alive in the squalor this type of production creates. At some point the economic, health, and environmental consequences are going to turn around and bite us. As you put it, those that for whom food is, “a mindnumbing, unemotional chore that involves shoveling organic matter from hand to mouth” this is a lot to swallow.

the main reason the current generation of americans dont know how to eat is because they never learned to cook as children.

other than teaching kids how to cook..organise family dinner time and shopping errands…dont place them on the carts..give them a list…let them take over the kitchen at least during the weekends..

while the above may sound irrelevant, it will absolutely change the mindset of the youth. young children who know how to eat grow up to be adults who know how to eat. children who enjoy food become adults who enjoy food. children who associate food with nutrition and taste rather than as a mindnumbing, unemotional chore that involves shoveling organic matter from hand to mouth will grow up to be parents who will pass on that enjoyment to their kids. food is not guilt. food is not therapy. food..the cooking and eating of it is a ritual. it is sacred. one generation is lost. someone has to save the next one.

teach them to eat vegetables. with meat on the side.

Big red, good points. I will say that in grad school we’re learning some stuff that has scared me into changing my habits – big time. Environmental problems are accelerating, and from what I’m learning, we are probably the last generation who has the chance to turn things around. After that, it will be too late.

So I’m not looking at this stuff as optional any more. I have the feeling that in 5 years, neither will anyone else.

(Now it’s my turn for chocolate – LOL)

Elitist Food Swine (so I’ve been told),

Claudia

Also, it’s the evil advertising farms, and people farming as a viable business, and those icky people in “flyover country” who haven’t had the enlightenment or blessing of living in the Upper West Side.

Are there major issues with food suppiles and production? Of course there are. But the level of class derision and condescension in the comments is staggering.

I think if in some way a change in attitude where quality begins to be valued over quantity and it becomes better to eat smaller portions of good food rather than huge quantities of mediocre food happens, then things will change. Until that time calling for reducing meat consumption only feeds into the diet industry mentality.

I think one way to make that change though is to make Americans pay the actual cost of what they consume. Do away with farm subsidies for big ag and give subsidies to small, local farms and you’d see people giving up all sorts of things in a hurry.

Americans eat a lot of protein because we can. There are a lot of types that romanticize poverty. “Oh wouldn’t it be so charming to only have pork one day every other month?” “I wish that beef was something so rare and precious, every time it was on the table, it was magical!”

But yes, try and live on flint corn rather than process it into feed. Also, better get really good at canning, because you’re going to have to be doing a lot of it.

I think the answer is peer pressure. That’s why it’s so crucial that people like Michael, Alton Brown and others are shown purchasing eco-friendly and humane products and giving an opinion on taste.

The other wrinkle is honesty; I look for shade-grown coffee and I see labels that say, “Our company supports the idea of growing coffee in shaded areas”. Great, is that “idea” just a big lie to trick the consumer? People think Fair Trade means Shade Grown, and it doesn’t. USDA labels need to be understood so people don’t get tricked.

Michael’s idea of buying local is one of the best out there; not everyone can afford the USDA certification and if my local guy is humanely rasing chickens or growing organic vegetables I don’t need a USDA label. Plus it saves on gas = less global warming.

Of course Joe sixpack may be too poor to afford this high end Whole Foods nonsense, which is disgusting because the working poor have to hear about how their chemically laden food is also cruel to animals and bad for the environment.

Call it just one more awful social injustice.

Sounds like the answer is simple education in portion control. Yeah, I know some people will continue to elevate gluttony from a deadly sin to a national past time regardless of how much information you spoon feed them. But…consider this. The USDA recommends 10% of daily calories from meat = roughly 50g based on a 2000 calorie diet. This equates to about 8 oz of lean meat a day. That’s right, I said a day…not per meal. How many consumers only eat 8 oz. of meat a day? I’m betting not many. Most of the people I know consume about 6-8 oz per meal. How many consumers even know how many ounces of meat they eat per day?

What’s my point? Telling the average consumer that they need to eat less meat to preserve the species, save the planet, etc. sadly won’t get their attention. However, showing them that they can save $ at the grocery by practicing portion control (and probably lose weight in the process) will get the attention of many. Which, in turn, will help achieve the goals of preserving the species and saving the planet.

Not to quibble over small stuff, but I think using the term “clone” in this case is incorrect. This is really a tissue culture, akin to the growing of skin cells for burn victims. I once saw a similar experiment used to grow sheets of black truffle cells in the same manner. Lacking the minerals and organic compounds that wild truffles are nourished by the taste was described as bland,and not much like a real truffle. I imagine “cultured” meat would be much the same. We would probably do better with Soylent Green. BTW even if you could grow enough meat that way(I’m picturing a bioreactor the size of Kansas right now) you would need nutrients to build and feed those cells. I will bet my life ADM would be right there with a corn based nutrient solution.
Think anyone would ever fund a large scale scientific experiment on intensive grazing?